Sorenson, shame on you!
Shame on you!
The provincial government of British Columbia, shame on you!
Shame on you!
The federal government of Canada, shame on you!
Shame on you!
Some of you may have heard by now, Sorenson set up a VRS (Video Relay Service) call centre in Burnaby, British Columbia. It is a province right above the state of Washington. Some of you may think that's a great thing. Well, it's not. It's already causing problems for the deaf communities in British Columbia. You see, Sorenson is not supported by either governments of B.C. (British Columbia) or Canada. That means we cannot use their services. Basically, it is okay for them to lure our interpreters away and cause a critical shortage, which they already have caused in several places across the USA.
You can read the article at The Vancouver Sun, just click here to read the article.
I first learned of this news in the Yahoo! Live chatroom by someone living in B.C. She was outraged over the story and I don't blame her one bit. I was outraged too when I learned of the news. It's hard to believe that we are already being negatively affected by the VRS and we don't even have a dedicated VRS provider in Canada. This shouldn't have been allowed to happen in the first place because of how it would affect our deaf communities.
It is already affecting them; they are now being forced to reserve an interpreter weeks in advance even for a simple doctor appointment or a job interview. So if you were called in for a job interview, which is to take place in two days, you are out of luck. I would like to know how this affects a life and death situation at a hospital. I certainly hope no one had to be denied an interpreter at a hospital due to the shortage in B.C. yet. That would be just terrible.
Money talks. The interpreters living in Canada will benefit from working for Sorenson because of the lucrative salaries along with attractive benefits.
The interpreters probably knew and were told that the deaf Canadians would not be able to use the VRS provided by Sorenson. It would be too easy to point fingers at the interpreters for abandoning the deaf communities in British Columbia. I don't hold anything against them; they are only trying to make a good living. We can't just sit here and say that everybody should have principles to stick to; you know it will not happen.
If you were offered a hefty salary with amazing benefits, would you turn it down? If you said yes, so did a lot of interpreters. If I were an interpreter, I probably would have accepted the job. Like I said, money talks.
In case some of my readers are unfamiliar with what a VRS is. It is called video relay service. You may be familiar with relay services provided by phone companies, if you aren't. Well, I will just boil it down to a simple explanation. A relay service provides you a third-party person to relay your messages to the person on the other side and do the same the other way around.
Video relay service is somewhat new when compared to text relay, which has been around for many years. The video relay services started to creep in at the crack of 21st century. Today, they are much, much more common and are a growing industry. Not only to mention the incentives they receive from the government for providing video and text relay services.
Earlier, I mentioned that we don't have a VRS provider in Canada. We are able to use a couple VRS, but they are not in Canada. So what happens is that when you call some 800 toll-free phone numbers, they will be directed to the places assigned with these numbers in the USA instead of Canada. That is something not a lot of people is aware of. I wouldn't be surprised if the VRS providers didn't know either.
If we were to set up a Canadian VRS provider, the real challenge is to get more interpreters to join the service because a large number of them are or will be already employed by Sorenson and possibly other video relay services. In fact, the person I spoke to at Yahoo! Live said that one of the solutions would for the government or a major telecom to share services with Sorenson and other VRS providers. This way, both Americans and Canadians will be able to gain access to the same services.
There are probably more ideas that some people may have tossed around. There are solutions and we need them as soon as possible because we don't want every province to be affected by the time we come up with a solution.
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5/19/2008 4:17 PM
Damn Sorenson...
It's not looking good when they steal Canada's interpreters for VRS usage when the deaf Canadiens sorely need the interpreters' services for dr. appts, hospitals, courts, schools, etc. That is not right.
That has been happening right here in USA as well. But I didn't think that Sorenson would go to Canada which it really DOESN'T even have VRS service. That has me scratching my head over this one. It's rather puzzling.
It would be interesting to see what Sorenson has to say to this.
Misha :D
5/19/2008 4:27 PM
why cant you move in USA here, then you will be happy? That is only way solution for you. hahah
5/19/2008 4:33 PM
Not all the terps ethuasnatically (msp.) work for the VRS companies.
Many terps left the VRS companies out of digust! They return to the community-based interpretings.
RLM
5/19/2008 4:34 PM
Mr. Anoynymous,
Move to other country is harder thing to do by get everything settle down.
5/19/2008 4:41 PM
You should not blame Sorenson alone... You forget all about your own Canada govt or BC govt or your city govt who gave OK to Sorenson to open up the business. So I guess your govt would appreciate TAX money. Simple as that....
5/19/2008 4:41 PM
RLM,
Yeah, but it goes both way. It's kind like revolving doors for them. Sh*t happens everywhere.
Anonymous,
Huh? What a bonehead and assasine comment you've made. Move to USA? Sorenson also takes the interpreters in USA, too. Now they're moving on to Canada when they may run dry in USA.
Misha :D
5/19/2008 4:44 PM
Anonymous #2, I didn't solely blame Sorenson.
Not to be rude, but did you read the whole thing?
If you did, you would see that I blamed Sorenson, the provincial government and the federal government. Not just Sorenson.
5/19/2008 4:50 PM
Banjo,
You're correct. I shouldn't emphasis Sorenson on taking the interpreters but I should have said other VRS providers such as Sprint, HOVRS, CDSVRS, etc. do take the interpreters as well. I should have added to my comment #6.
Misha :D
5/19/2008 4:54 PM
The newspapers article has not surprised me at all because I know it has been problematic to D/deaf communities across Canada. In Ontario, we have already lost some interpreters to the Sorenson.
Canada will have their own VRS services later this year. Telus Canada and Bell Canada will be responsible in running separate two VRS services. There are several major problems with their services:
1) Telus provides their VRS to only two provinces - Alberta and British Columbia while the Bell Canada will do the same to Ontario and Quebec only. Six out of ten provinces will not have VRS. That is not right. ALL provinces and three territories MUST have full acess to VRS period. Blame it on CRTC (Canada's version of FCC) for their policies and procedures and the CRTC have lacked their understanding and knowledge in what the D/deaf people needs in order to have this kind of service.
2) Will the Telus and Bell Canada hire enough certified and highly qualified interpreters for their services while the Sorenson have already robbed interpreters from us?
3) How will they determine whether the interpreters are enough qualified or certified while the services are very new to them?
4) Telus will NOT hire D/deaf people as installers or technicians. How can their hearing installers or technicians communicate with their D/deaf customers while training or explaining to them about the technical issues?
Actually the Canadian Association of the Deaf (CAD) and Canadian Cultural Society of the Deaf (CCSD) tried to get a license in order to operate the NATIONAL VRS, but the problem is the CRTC outdated CRTC policy that states the ILECs (phone, cable and internet companies) are given first choices to run VRS. It is why it has prevented Deaf people in Atlantic Canada, Manitoba, Saskatchewan and the Territories from obtaining VRS from the Canadian-based VRS.
5/19/2008 5:04 PM
Darryl, thank you for the information on the current progress on the Canadian VRS providers.
I did hear a few things about them recently but did not know enough to write about it. I may have to now that you brought more to the table here.
CRTC is pathetic and I mean pathetic. I don't like how they flip-flop and then impose outrageous guidelines and rules onto everybody only to break them.
I also hate how they allow the TV stations to hook up to the American channels to fill in their commercial ads so they don't lose revenues.
StarChoice is one of the worst for this. They often insert their own ads on a lot of channels especially CNN and and similar channels.
Screw the CRTC. It's a joke. It's hard to believe that we still don't have a TAP for mobile phones anywhere in Canada. (TAP - Text Accessibility Plan)
Pathetic, just pathetic.
5/19/2008 6:06 PM
well, Sorenson should not receive all the blame. The deaf population that use Sorenson VRS should get their equal share of the blame because they continue to use Sorenson VRS.
It is the deaf population that significantly increases Sorenson VRS revenues, which in turn allows them to build more call centers.
However, there is one very simple solution to that.....STOP USING SORENSON VRS!
It's ultimately your call if you want to help increase this problems by using a vrs service to a company that simply does not give a shit about community interpreting, I would suggest that you take your VRS service elsewhere otherwise you are contributing to this problem yourself.
5/19/2008 6:14 PM
I blew the horn on this 5 yrs ago when i realized it was getting harder to find interpreters for court, medical, school.
No one listened cause my horn wasnt deaf enough!
5/19/2008 6:22 PM
This is an issue in Canada, not the USA. Sorenson is causing a shortage in the B.C. The only people benefitting from it are Sorenson, the interpreters and the governments. Once again, it is the deaf Canadians who have to get the short end of the stick. They won't be able to use the Sorenson VRS because it is intended for the deaf Americans only.
We are focusing on the situation in B.C., not the other situations in other places. This situation solely involves Sorenson.
They don't have that many interpreters in B.C. and they don't need an American corporation to worsen the problem for them.
The only way to stop Sorenson from taking our interpreters is to shut down the call centre in B.C.
It's a situation where deaf people's rights in Canada are being interfered with by an American corporation. Should we tolerate it?
No.
5/19/2008 6:33 PM
To quote Anonymous (Comment No. 11)
"However, there is one very simple solution to that.....STOP USING SORENSON VRS!"
The problem with that is that Canadians don't really use Sorenson VRS because they are not available to Canadians.
So ultimately, it is up to the Americans on if they want to make an impact or not. Either that or we will have to push the government into taking action against Sorenson. But will that happen? Well, it won't be easy, nearly impossible to do. Somebody will have to try.
5/19/2008 9:11 PM
the interpreter shortage isn't just in the B.C. area, its also practically in every city where there is a Sorenson call center across America.
5/19/2008 9:18 PM
Anonymous, yes... that's true. Though it's about the call centre in B.C.
The thing is, these interpreters who are living in Canada are not being used to our benefits, only the Americans.
5/19/2008 9:21 PM
Simple economics. Flow of labour into a different sub-field of interpreting. There is no 'stealing' going on.
The interpreting market in BC was in a condition that Sorenson could setup and employ many interpreters that were barely making ends meet. Many had to resort to part-time jobs to compliment their income. Some even dropped out of interpreting because of the lack of work.
The cost of living in BC is extremely high compared to many cities in Canada. A typical house can start at $500,000. So the potential to earn a regular income in interpreting was a no brainer decision. What would anyone else do?
It's not ideal. The interpreting work being performed is not benefitng the Canadian deaf community. But the deaf community wasn't being benifited when many interpreters were unable to provide interpreting due to the lack of work.
It's simply a case where the economics favored Sorenson setting up a center. However, the economic, moral and ethical issues involved are complex.
The issues are complex. Are there truly not enough interpreters? How do you know for sure? What information do you have to back that up other than hearsay? Did Sorenson really cause the shortage in BC? Or are there other factors at play that you simply do not know about? What did the interpreting and deaf community do when there were many interpreters complaining about the lack of work in BC? Did they try and change things locally? Did agencies and private interpreting companies do anything about it?
So many factors and yet only a narrow minded approach to what is percieved as a 'critical' shortage of interpreters.
5/19/2008 9:41 PM
Anonymous, anonymous, anonymous.
Some people need to start naming themselves. Otherwise, I won't know who I'm talking to.
Anyway, even though the shortage may not be critical at the moment. However, there is an interpreting program in Vancouver that may be shut down soon. This is bad timing, and that means a reduction in interpreting students.
Economics, economics, economics...
You also have to think of the people with disabilities and what rights they are given.
The problem with letting a foreign nation taking advantage of our resources is not seeing the potential problems that may occur before we allow it to take place.
Eventually, it will hit the fan and then it will be too late. The damages would already be done.
People need to start seeing beyond the present. They need to see the future and what to do about it.
I can tell you for a fact that interpreters here in Ontario, you have to call for an interpreter a week or two weeks in advance, sometimes even longer.
It would be nice to hear someone from British Columbia speak out on this situation and how many interpreters are available whenever called for or not.
It's not just about the economics. Especially when the government of USA is giving incentives to Sorenson for it. How is that economic? The taxpayers are being given the bill to pay for the deaf's needs.
(shrugs)
Sorenson is worth billions, but the VRS section is largely supported by the government through incentives.
5/19/2008 10:13 PM
Banjo,
I intend to ask this question earlier but forgot. People from Canada can use VRS? Since it's under FCC? How does it work? If not then why Sorenson in Canada and get paid?
Thanks
5/20/2008 1:01 AM
You said:
"Anyway, even though the shortage may not be critical at the moment. However, there is an interpreting program in Vancouver that may be shut down soon."
Lets get the facts straight shall we. It's a Deaf Studies program not an interpreting program that is at risk of closing. Major difference don't you think?
Anyways, it IS about economics. It's organic as a tree budding in the spring. You never know what the tree is going to look like every year.
Same with labour. You have shortages and then you have excess of labour. That is reality. It has nothing to do with incentives that any VRS company gets. It comes down to supply and demand of services or goods.
It is also true that practically in any major Canadian city there is a 2 - 3 week booking window for interpreters. And this was before any Sorenson touched Canadian soil.
I also notice that you didn't tackle any of those questions that I wrote. That was the thrust of my argument. There are so many factors at play here. You just can't hone in on singular factors. That's too simple and reduces the argument to nothing.
By the way, taxpayers are always being hit up for the bill regardless if Sorenson was here or not.
Outsourcing is something that occurs worldwide. How many Canadian companies do you think are employing foreign workers on foreign lands? It's supply and demand. This is the driving force behind companies like Sorenson. Does it make it right? Again, it's a complex question.
Let's not forget one thing too. Sorenson is a private enterprise. And as such, employs it's rights to provide goods and services to whom they seem fit. We might no like it, but this is the price we pay for living in a free Western world.
By the way, what exactly are the damages that have occurred or the problems that could happen in the future? It's kind of broad sweeping assertion.
I won't use the name anonymous. How about Ron.
Regards
5/20/2008 1:42 AM
Ron? as in Ron Burdett, vice president of community relations for sorenson vrs?
5/20/2008 6:43 AM
You said:
"Ron? as in Ron Burdett, vice president of community relations for sorenson vrs?"
(shrugs) (sigh)
Are you seriously asking this question. Don't you think for a minute that if Sorenson wanted to respond in an official manner that they would have? Would they have responded under anonymous?
Questions to ponder before asking conspiratorial questions.
To answer this question. No. It is not. It was a random name to replace anonymous.
Continue......
5/20/2008 8:58 AM
1. Sorenson's policy --no interpreter can work outside on freelance or for agency...Is that fact?
THAT IS THE REASON the policy hurt deaf community.
I have some friends work for Sorenson. They really want to work part-time as interpreters for deaf community(they like to interpret eyes to eyes)
2. Yes, money talks. Wonder the company will cost all doctors, hospital, job interviews, etc a lot of money to use VRI.
My parents tried to get VRI setup at their doctor office which has about 100 deaf patients to see. Doctor told my parents, Sorenson is insanely expensive!!!
5/20/2008 2:09 PM
At $50 p/h, now that's a steal. Goodwill and morals' out the window.
5/20/2008 2:41 PM
drmzz
you said:
"At $50 p/h, now that's a steal. Goodwill and morals' out the window."
Wow..not a judgmental statement at all. Nope, couldn't find any 'higher than thou' sentiment in that statement. More assertions, no constructive comments. You realize you insult a bunch of people without knowing what their morals or beliefs in goodwill are.
Hedy
you said:
"1. Sorenson's policy --no interpreter can work outside on freelance or for agency...Is that fact?
THAT IS THE REASON the policy hurt deaf community."
No, not true. You are free to come and go as you please between working at Sorenson and the community. If you are looking for tighter controls, look no further than the Taliban in Afghanistan :)
It would be nice to see a cost breakdown for ANY VRS company to see how they validate their costs. Anyone?
Ron
5/21/2008 10:15 AM
Ron,
Why do I have the feeling you work for Sorenson?
5/22/2008 5:10 AM
VP users, always ask Sorenson VRS terps if they are U.S. citizens. If not, hang up your VP-100/200 and dial again or use another VRS.
Look at the greedy faces of Sorenson Company: http://www.sorenson.com/company/bios.php.
I work for Federal agency and I do not want to get into major trouble with federal law: treason. I have to do federal business on phone with other federal agencies. Can you imagine that foreigners learning our secret U.S. government language.
I.E., Deaf U.S. Dept of Defense Civilian talks to Hearing U.S. Dept. of Defense Military persons via Foreign VRS Terps in Canada working for Sorenson Company.
I bet Sorenson Company is obtaining lots of money from our FCC (Federal Communication Commission).
Sorenson VRS users, do you support treason against U.S. government? If not, please study the faces and names of Sorenson Company: http://www.sorenson.com/company/bios.php. Correct me if I am wrong….
Mookie
5/24/2008 1:41 PM
Mookie, no one is supposed to discuss classified information over an unsecure phone line. That includes hearing and deaf alike. If you aren't discussing classified information on your VRS calls, then you don't have to worry about the nationality of the VRS terp.
Reba
5/28/2008 9:21 PM
Dear Reba,
What makes you think I would accidentally leak secretive data of "VRS Project" on the telecommunication line via the VRS? Oh, give me a break...
Maybe you would probably spill your beans if you accidentally spoke your global bank loan officials via the remote bank center in China in order to discuss SSN for your hubby's private handy business for lowest interest rate.
I would have to make a call in order to get my message if they could not response to my email. That does not mean I would share whole info even I have top-level clearance security.
5/29/2008 8:11 AM
Dear Mookie,
I didn't mean to imply that at all.
I only wanted to reassure you that using Canadian terps wouldn't be treason.
I don't support Sorenson's plan but that doesn't mean I wouldn't trust certified Canadian terps any less than U.S. terps.
If you (or anyone) isn't discussing classified information over the phones, then there is no reason to worry about foreign terps.
Hearing and deaf people have to use their judgment about discussing personal or government sensitive information over any phones.
Reba
6/09/2008 8:35 PM
1. I make $50 an hour at Sorenson? lol. I wish.
2. Sorenson encourages us to do more community work. I'm very curious who is spreading the rumor that we aren't able to. Sorenson has the most flexible scheduling out of the VRS companies I've worked for.
3. "Lucrative"? lol. Great benefits? Most of us (a VAST, VAST majority) are part-timers who work in the community or education and we do NOT have benefits. The rumors that fly are amazing.
4. I should also clarify that I don't agree with outsourcing, whether it's me calling my cell phone's tech support or my parents calling VRS.
Heh, at least the Canadian VRS terps speak English, I guess. That's better than you can say for most outsourcing.
8/08/2008 9:39 PM
I'm a VRS interpreter in the US. I don't work for Sorenson, but I used to. I work for another company, and we DO take Canadian calls. Frankly, I'm annoyed that we do, because my tax money is paying for VRS, and IMO it should be used for American citizens. But then again, I'm sad for Canadian Deaf who don't have VRS, so, I guess there are two sides to my opinion.
I think the best solution would be a partnership between the US and Canadian governments for VRS provision, because our system is already well established, and your people are using it already, anyway.
Another thing, most, MOST, VRS interpreters are NOT full time. It's hard work, stressful, and demanding, and most people can't handle it 40 hours a week. I only do 10 to 15. I know one of the interpreters in the BC call center, and she is like me. She still does community work.
One more FYI; in my community, VRS now pays less that community work. So no, money is not the only motivation. I like variety; I do all kinds of interpreting except legal.
8/09/2008 9:20 AM
Do you mean you get less than $25/hr, and no benefits (insurance, vacation, training ops, etc.)?
8/10/2008 6:15 PM
AZTerp, I agree. We need our government to establish a partnership with the American VRS services in order to make fair uses of the services.
I know Sorenson don't take Canadian calls, but I know HOVRS and Viable do because I've used them in the past. There's no other options except for Bell Relay which is text-based, my TTY can't do anything right these days. TTYs are still expensive to this day, and with the government program, they may pay up to around 75% for the TTYs as long as they don't exceed $500.
Honestly, I haven't used my TTY machine in years. I hate that thing. Hopefully Telus and Bell do set up their VRS for real by the end of this year as somebody reported earlier. If so, I'll definitely be using them.